Bad enough that someone was killed by a polar bear. One might point out that polar bears are great big predators and killing is what they do to survive. They kill their own food. They are built for it and have adapted such that they do it very well. Cuddly teddy bears, they are not. We could ask ourselves questions about why people went into a polar bear’s territory unprepared, but that’s by the by.
Oh, no, this could get worse, it could happen even more. Because, because… Yup, global warming…
Is there no low to which this organisation will not stoop to peddle this scam? Is there no story to which they will not try to pin it upon?
I’m not sure that people did go to ‘a polar bear’s territory unprepared’ did they?
Still, it hardly is a newsworthy event. Student killed on adventure trip. Sorry for the family and all that, but this stuff happens.
Meantime another 9 people were killed on the roads of the UK. As they are every day of the year.
The reports seem to be a bit mixed, but from what I can gather they were unarmed. I’d say that was fairly unprepared.
IT (GW) IS NOT A SCAM
IT IS TRUE
That governments might and do use it as an excuse to screw irrelevant taxes out of us is , excuse me, a separate issue.
Global Warming is real, and a great danger IF it gets so bad that the Greenland Ice-Cap starts to melt.
For now, I will leve off the solid proof for this.
Please also note the very powerful and corrupt people and corporations spending serious sums of money, trying to convince people that “GW is a scam” – like J=Koch and Exxon.
As for “unprepared” (LR) they WERE armed, a gun WAS fired, but it merely wounded the bear – rather than killing it.
Which made things worse, of course.
Oops.
Dear Mr Tingey, please may I suggest you listen a speech by Professor Murry Salby at the Sydney Institute ,”Global Emission of Carbon Dioxide: The Contribution from Natural Sources”
Professor Muray is the Chair of Climate Science at Macquire University. You can listen to the speech via http://www.joannenova.com.au
Something else that might be of interest is the latest empirical evidence published by NASA re heat escaping the Earths atmosphere.
These are serious studies which cast great doubt on the GW science as it stands.
I was going to link to that too John Leon, you’ve saved me a job.
On the Polar Bear, I think the team leaders must have been armed as it seems that it was one of them who shot it. Presumably they didn’t fire soon enough, bears can move incredibly quickly and have a very long reach.
Then I stand corrected on the matter of people being armed. As I said, reports seem to be a bit mixed. However, the idea that the ice caps are melting and that we will be facing polar bears on a more regular basis is mere scaremongering. Climate changes. it always has. If it stops changing, I might start to worry.
Feeding Etonians to Polar Bears? Might too much rich food harm the bears digestion? (Sorry, couldn’t resist that one).
Global warming ‘true’ Greg? Okay, I’ll bite, where is it? Certainly not up here in the Pacific North West. I don’t dispute that the climate shifts and changes all the time, but what I will argue is that humans have precious little to do with global climate shifts. As for CO2 being responsible – there are no empirical proofs, just statistics.
One of the injured is the one that shot the bear dead. However, I would suggest, as an armchair pundit, they should have posted guards during sleeping hours (remember at this time of year there is no real night at that latitude, although it might get a bit murky for an hour or so). I heard there was a perimeter alarm system, but it froze.
So, good old fashioned incompetence then?
One of my nieces was in Svalbard a few years ago and visited an ice cave, the entrance was via a narrow manhole and she didn’t want to go down as she’s a bit claustrophobic, as the tour leader said ” you can stay here if you like but you’ll soon come down when the bears turn up ” !
The bear was eventually killed so the party was certainly armed, but when they began shooting isn’t said. I can’t help but wonder if the bear’s questionable status as a protected species (all because of warble gloaming, natch) made whoever had the gun reluctant to start shooting until it was already too late.
As soon as we heard the story I said to Mrs Bud that I’d like to bet a few bob that someone would link it to global warming. The odds would have been very short.
“Please also note the very powerful and corrupt people and corporations spending serious sums of money, trying to convince people that “GW is a scam” – like J=Koch and Exxon.”
Care to put some substance behind that assertion, Greg Tingey? It is very difficult to “note” something if it lacks facts to back it up.
Oh, and shouting makes you seem a tad unhinged.
Try Google for Koch Brothers …..
As for GW, well, in science it is well-established that the more measurements you take, the smaller the error-bars get.
It’s like “surveys”: a sample of <30 isn't worth squat.
A sample of 100 is a start, 1000 is reasonable, and 10 000 will get you some solid data.
Well, there's a long-running multi-observer survey running in this country, based on very simple observations collected by unpaid volunteers (I'm one) of whom there are, now, well over 10 000. What we do is note simple events during the seasons. Opening of specific flower species, leafing/flowering of trees, appearance of migratory birds, butterflies etc. This occurs in both Spring and Autumn. Fortunately, we have records going back over 250 years in this country in some places.
These results are then collated.
GW is happening.
For more information on this survey:
Try "Natures Calendar" or:
http://www.naturescalendar.org.uk/
I know "Nullis in verbia” but, don’t you think that if the Royal Society, and EVERY similar scientific body on the planet are agreed that GW is real, and needs dealing with – please note I go no further than that – might just have a case, rather than the vast vested interests, usually extreme right-wingers like the Kochs and Exxon ??
So you don’t have evidence, Greg, you want us to go and look for it.
We’re talking about AGW, not GW. It is not surprising that the world would warm after the Little Ice Age quite naturally without any help from humans.
The pronouncements of the Royal Society and similar such societies represent the thoughts (not science) of a small group of politically inclined members. It might be more interesting if they polled all their members. Most of the people who sit on these committees are not climate scientists but do enjoy hobnobbing with politicians.
How did you go with the Professor Murry Salby talk, any comments?
WRONG
There is plenty of evidence, and you obviously don’t understand how science works – your idea of a closed political coterie is so far out, it’s not even wrong.
However.
IF the world is warming up, THEN there will be more energy in the “system”, and weather will become more violent.
This: http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/18ba7186-b854-11e0-8d23-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1UKyIITho
Is a link to this weekend’s FT.
Look at the graph (source given) with the article.
I do have evidence, it’s not difficult to find – approximately 3 or 4 mouse-clicks will give it to you too.
That’s how I found it, after all.
AND I DID point you DIRECTLY to some evidence – “Natures’ Calendar”, or are you trying to carefully ignore that?
1) if you go somewhere inhabited by large carnivores, for the specific purpose of seeing said carnivores close up, you can hardly complain if they give you what you wanted.
2) If you truly believe polar bears are threatened (by climate change or other mechanisms) – it seems un-helpful to kill them off for annoying you.
I would be willing to discuss ‘climate change’ with Greg Tingey, over a couple of bottles of wine from the North Yorkshire vineyards that were in production during the Roman occupation 1-2c AD.
Wattsupwiththat.com has quite extensive charts & statistics – but these are probably of little interest as they present the ‘skeptical’ viewpoint.
Vineyards in the SOuth of England then, yes … as now.
Is there proof of NORTH Y’kshire vine-growing?
Really?
Your link, Greg, is an indication of GW, not proof of AGW. Nobody denies that there has been a degree of GW since the Littlr Ice Age, it is the cause and the consequences that are contested.
If you have clear evidence regarding powerful and corrupt people doing anything illegal or immoral with their money, let’s have it, I don’t want to go fishing for unfounded allegations.
And your still shouting, very impolite.
That’s horrible and terrifying. I’m very sorry for him, may his soul RIP. The bears are animals and they don’t judge, they cannot think because they aren’t humans…
Oh dear. Seems like it might be plain old PPPPPP failure.
An explosive trip wire designed to scare off approaching animals failed to trigger and without a watchman there was no second line of defence.
Mike Reid, the 29-year-old expedition leader, desperately tried to shoot the animal after it attacked the tent where people were sleeping, explained Superintendent Arild Lyssand . But each time he pulled the trigger the rifle failed to go off. His fellow guide Andy Ruck, 27, tried to fire a flare gun, but that failed too.
Moments later, having fatally hurt Horatio, the bear turned its attention to Mr Reid, severely injuring him. It then returned to the tent where it attacked one other teenager before chasing down a third, who had tried to escape. Mr Reid picked up a round off the ground which had failed to fire and reloaded. He then shot the bear in the head and killed it.
Superintendent Lyssand said: “The 29 year-old picked up the rifle and pulled the trigger but the gun didn’t fire. Why did this happen?
“The gunman fired again but again it didn’t go off. He fired all four bullets in magazine but none went off. We need to look at the routines of this British company to see that they were in order.”
Wonder if the safety was “on”?
As for GW, at least here we are making some progress.
Since least the correspondents here seem to accept that it is real, and are “just” disputing the causes.
My opinion is that there is more than one cause, but human actions are one of them.
Most anti-GW proponents are trying to deny ANY GW AT ALL.
Given that a round that failed to fire once did fire when picked up and reloaded that’s a pretty good question.
Incidentally, I’ve never come across any sceptic that thinks there has been no change and even the ones who think there is no anthropogenic effect are a minority. That’s not actually what’s being argued at all.
Angry Exile @ 23
They exist – try Christopher Booker or James Delingpole or “Vox Populi” or the Koch’s mentioned above or Lord Monckton, or just any christian US fundie …..
We could ask ourselves questions about why people went into a polar bear’s territory unprepared
Precisely.
Greg, leaving aside the US Christian fundies (relevance? I may not take their beliefs even remotely seriously but that doesn’t necessarily disqualify them from calling bullshit when they see it) I’m pretty familiar with most of those you mention. As far as I recall they do not claim that there is no warming and they do not claim there is no anthropogenic effect. The claim “it’s a scam”, if it’s been put exactly that way, does not equal “there has been no warming”. Nor does it equal “mankind’s contribution is zero”. As I said, that’s not what’s being argued.
The scam comment refers to the tendency of the green lunatic fringe to use AGW as an excuse to tax us into penury and to link just about every story to AGW – in order to tax us into penury.
As I mentioned earlier; climate changes. It has changed pretty consistently since the molten rock solidified and that primeval soup grew legs.
The day it stops changing, let me know and I will start to worry.
I actually agree with Longrider that there IS a scam in operation.
Using the REAL problems of GW as an excuse to raise taxes in the wrong areas.
As I said before, that is a separate issue to the reality and causes of GW.