NickM covers this one pretty well and says pretty much what I think about the idea.
EDUCATION Secretary Michael Gove today unveils a plan to bring a dramatic improvement to classroom discipline by introducing military-style cadet forces to every secondary school.
He believes the Combined Cadet Force, which has been credited with transforming the lives of some of Britain’s most troubled teenagers, could be the key to a dramatic revolution in school standards.
This is a variation on a very old theme – that military discipline will work wonders. Military discipline is designed to make people do things that ordinarily, they probably wouldn’t – like cross no man’s land into a rain of machine gun fire and certain death. It instils the ability to follow orders, to do as one is told, to obey unthinkingly because someone in authority has told them.
Like Nick, I have nothing against the military. I nearly signed up to the Fleet Air Arm as a chopper pilot, but decided against it eventually. I just couldn’t quite commit. I served for a while as a reservist in the RNR and that did confirm that my decision was probably the right one. I am not military material. I don’t do orders. Never have, never will. I am far too independent and self-willed.
If you are the right person, it can work. If not, it will be a waste of time. I’ve no idea whether Gove intends this to be voluntary or not, the piece doesn’t say. If it is voluntary, I have no beef with it, but I suspect that the people he intends to target will give the whole thing a miss and if it is compulsory, the rebels will rebel, spoiling it for those who do want to be there. I would have done likewise had I been conscripted into such an organisation. You cannot instil military discipline on those who refuse to accept it.
Conscription – if this is what it is – is wrong. We are not the chattels of the state to use as it sees fit and we owe the state nothing, it exists to serve us, not the other way around. There is never a justification. Yes, I know, we went through two world wars when millions were conscripted and thrown headlong into the jaws of death following a pissing contest between the ruling houses of Europe. A pissing contest paid for with the lives of a generation of young men – and unfinished business saw another generation thrown onto the bonfire of the the politicians’ vanities. If those young men of Europe had been a little more rebellious and refused to comply in their millions, those wars would have been somewhat curtailed.
Conscription is always wrong, it is always immoral. And, I guess, Gove’s social conservatism is showing though if he really thinks that a bit of military discipline will solve the years of decay that have corroded our youth. The only discipline that is worth anything, frankly, is self-discipline. Sure, you need to be taught it, but you don’t need the military to do that. I had it long before I joined the RNR.
He says putting Britain’s pupils on parade would “build patriotism” in the country’s wayward youth, giving them the organisational and team skills necessary to succeed in life.
Ah, yes, patriotism. The last refuge of the scoundrel.
“patriotism. The last refuge of the scoundrel.”
I suspect you actually mean those who would attempt to use patriots for their own ends.
I’m a patriot, I love my country, I just don’t like those who run it.
Do I like my country? Yes.
Would I take up arms in the event of an invasion? Yes.
Do I consider myself a patriot? No.
Like you, I despise those who run the country. I also despise those who would conscript others to do their dirty work. Their use of patriotism to encourage others to lay down their lives for them is beneath contempt.
LR, two things:
Cadets in schools does not necessarily mean conscription. It does not follow that because a youngster in in a cadet force they will automatically take up a career in the military. My eldest is a cadet sgt in the ATC, and he loves it. Does he want to join, RAF? No. At one stage he did, until he discovered particle physics. So now he wants to destroy the planet by creating dark matter at CERN.
I have been in the military, and one soon learns to pervert the orders one is given It is very easy to drive a CO to distraction by either pretending to misinterpret what you have been told, or follow them to the letter of the law. Then again, I was in the Medical Corps, which was less militarised than the Infantry and other corps. Do you do extraordinary things – yes, very much so. And I loved it.
To be fair, I did say that in the post 😉
What everyone said.
Disclosure: Horribly passed over Cpl in RAF Section at school CCF, then nearly took best student at RMAS when becoming 2nd Lt in TA.
Forcing people to do cadets? Stupid and counterproductive
Conscription? Evil and counterproductive
The difference between these two is that cadets aren’t going to be put in the line of fire.
The problem of course is that it isn’t as simple as all that. “A bit of military discipline” really can be the making of some wayward teenagers. If they have enough spark to turn bolshiness into “I’ll show those bastards”, they get a success and the pride and self-esteem that comes from it, then you’re away. The danger is of course that that is much harder to do if your candidate is surrounded by lots who really genuinely don’t give a toss.
That’s not really the issue here. It’s the enforced servitude that’s the issue irrespective of what that serviturde is.
If it is voluntary, the scrotes targeted won’t bother with it. If it’s compulsory. then they will make everyone’s life a misery. All in all, a stupid idea, then…
Interesting to see how this equates alongside the Ooman Rites Act. I see the HRA lawyers being very busy.
I doubt joining the CCF will be compulsory. It wasn’t at my school. I joined and it was fun as well. It wasn’t all square bashing and polishing and blancoing. I enjoyed the shooting too. I think having the choice is important.