As you have experience of working on the railways LR, I would be interested in hearing your reasons for your answer to this question. I tend to think that state ownership of any industry is generally a bad thing. The thing is, I don’t really see the sort of semi privatised hotch potch that we have now as being that brilliant either.
BR was dreadful – all of the typical problems associated with a state run organisation and heavily unionised workforce. What we have is far from perfect – and I agree, a hotch potch – but having worked with both, this is still better than what went before. I still favour a vertical rather than horizontal split, though. At least with the present arrangements, we have some of the benefits of private enterprise. Even Network Rail, which is nationalised in everything but name still has to nod in the direction of market forces.
Better service – yes, despite the moans – more trains, more miles travelled and continued safety improvements. Would this have happened under BR? Dunno, we will never be certain, but as I said, I prefer the railways now to then and have no desire to return.
Thanks for that, it seems to be pretty much what I thought. I’m generally not a fan of public transport but on the rare occasions when I have used trains my experience has been reasonably positive. The impression that I get of what it is like commuting into London is that it is a terrible experience but that people seem to have little alternative. My cycle commute involves about five miles along the former Hull to Hornsea railway line.
‘Re’-nationalisation? When were they denationalised? The Government owns the company that owns the track/infrastructure and owns the rights to run services over the track they own which they then subcontract to various companies AND pay them huge subsidies to do so.
In which Universe is that privatisation?
The problem with the railways is they are perceived as a ‘right’, a social service which should be paid for by everyone else.
It is a trade off – live in the countryside, bigger house, cheaper mortgage, higher travel costs v live in town/city, smaller house and bigger mortgage but lower travel costs. Those in the country feel they should only have the benefits and not have to pay so much for travel – its ‘unfair’ – so somebody else should pay hence the call of renationalisation.
The fact is railways were invented to transport freight which they can do round the clock, so operate efficiently and thus profitably.
Passenger transportation was just icing on the cake and was profitable as long as freight made up the bulk.
Passenger use of railways is inefficient as it is confined mostly to two week-day peak periods.
Once freight started moving off the railways, that really was the end of any prospect of running them profitably.
Had Government not nationalised/subsidised railways and penalised competition, I doubt they would still be running, except for bulky freight
Driver-less cars will spell their end, if Government keeps its nose out.
France has nationalised railways which have low fares and are losing more and more passengers, including on TGV routes, and therefore cutting back services. The proposed TGV line to Limoges (HS2 anyone) has just been cancelled because likely traffic will not make it economically viable, and the Bordeaux – Toulouse extension is in limbo.
As you have experience of working on the railways LR, I would be interested in hearing your reasons for your answer to this question. I tend to think that state ownership of any industry is generally a bad thing. The thing is, I don’t really see the sort of semi privatised hotch potch that we have now as being that brilliant either.
BR was dreadful – all of the typical problems associated with a state run organisation and heavily unionised workforce. What we have is far from perfect – and I agree, a hotch potch – but having worked with both, this is still better than what went before. I still favour a vertical rather than horizontal split, though. At least with the present arrangements, we have some of the benefits of private enterprise. Even Network Rail, which is nationalised in everything but name still has to nod in the direction of market forces.
Better service – yes, despite the moans – more trains, more miles travelled and continued safety improvements. Would this have happened under BR? Dunno, we will never be certain, but as I said, I prefer the railways now to then and have no desire to return.
Thanks for that, it seems to be pretty much what I thought. I’m generally not a fan of public transport but on the rare occasions when I have used trains my experience has been reasonably positive. The impression that I get of what it is like commuting into London is that it is a terrible experience but that people seem to have little alternative. My cycle commute involves about five miles along the former Hull to Hornsea railway line.
‘Re’-nationalisation? When were they denationalised? The Government owns the company that owns the track/infrastructure and owns the rights to run services over the track they own which they then subcontract to various companies AND pay them huge subsidies to do so.
In which Universe is that privatisation?
The problem with the railways is they are perceived as a ‘right’, a social service which should be paid for by everyone else.
It is a trade off – live in the countryside, bigger house, cheaper mortgage, higher travel costs v live in town/city, smaller house and bigger mortgage but lower travel costs. Those in the country feel they should only have the benefits and not have to pay so much for travel – its ‘unfair’ – so somebody else should pay hence the call of renationalisation.
The fact is railways were invented to transport freight which they can do round the clock, so operate efficiently and thus profitably.
Passenger transportation was just icing on the cake and was profitable as long as freight made up the bulk.
Passenger use of railways is inefficient as it is confined mostly to two week-day peak periods.
Once freight started moving off the railways, that really was the end of any prospect of running them profitably.
Had Government not nationalised/subsidised railways and penalised competition, I doubt they would still be running, except for bulky freight
Driver-less cars will spell their end, if Government keeps its nose out.
France has nationalised railways which have low fares and are losing more and more passengers, including on TGV routes, and therefore cutting back services. The proposed TGV line to Limoges (HS2 anyone) has just been cancelled because likely traffic will not make it economically viable, and the Bordeaux – Toulouse extension is in limbo.